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We put it on an FTP site and had an article on mozillaZine, which is a community news site. It was already getting as many downloads as a Mozilla milestone. On the one side, you had a lot of Mozilla people the hardcore developer types who didn t like what we were doing, because focusing on mom and dad is heretical in much of the open source world. Then there were a lot of people who were saying, Finally, Mozilla is stepping away from its geek roots and doing something more mainstream. We got a lot of coverage early on from bloggers and PC World and stuff like that. It got out of control pretty quickly.

Livingston: Did you have problems getting users at the beginning Ross: No, but the users we were getting weren t really the target audience; these were people that downloaded beta builds from Mozilla. So it was still a geek audience. We had to transform the culture at Mozilla because it was all based around open source ethos, which says programmers are kings, marketers are sleaze, and everyone else can read the manual. All the branding for Mozilla looked very Communist the logo was a dinosaur and the banners ads were . . . I can t even describe it, but very odd, technical kind of imagery that didn t appeal to most people. We had to move a lot of that into a more mainstream world. Livingston: How did you do that Ross: The first thing that happened was that Netscape split off Mozilla into an independent entity. Mozilla was once just the open source technology arm of Netscape they made technology and Netscape distributed it. When Netscape said goodbye, Mozilla didn t really have any kind of major distributor anymore. As Firefox matured, Mozilla decided that they could try to distribute it directly to the user without having to go through a middleman like Netscape. At that point, the culture started to shift out of necessity; the organization had to cater to more users or potentially collapse. Livingston: As you were working on this, did you worry about competitive

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Ross: No, Firefox was very different from traditional startups. Companies usu-

The cost of distributing a hard-copy manual and the cost of maintaining the information that s in a hard-print manual is unbelievable until you ve experienced it..

ally worry about competition for financial reasons, but when we did Firefox, money was just always sort of there. There were donations, seed money from AOL; we eventually got this Google deal, but it wasn t a source of fear for us, because we knew if it didn t make money . . . It wasn t even supposed to make money it was a hobby, right, so we didn t really care. I was in school. It didn t have to succeed. It sounds bad, but the project was kind of just for us at the beginning to make something that we knew we could make, but not inside Netscape. It was an outlet for those frustrations. We wanted people to use it, but we weren t going to kill ourselves if it failed. We defined success in terms of users, not competitors. In any case, the IE team had been disbanded, and Netscape had bowed out, so the market was wide open. We didn t crunch numbers or conduct market analysis; we relaxed and followed our gut. There s a lot more pressure now with Parakey. People expect another Firefox or something like that.

over-deliver when everyone s promising things for you. We re trying not to hype up what we re doing until we ve got something people can use. People expect the world, so if you hype up what you are doing, you have to deliver, and it s not easy.

Livingston: Did any competitors ever do anything to anger you Ross: Not directly. The only thing that bothers me is that Microsoft seems com-

available in color on the Web as a download, and I would urge you to download these figures and have them handy when reading the book. To download the figures in color, point your browser to www.apress.com/book/view/ 1590599713 and look at the Book Extras section.

pletely driven by competition We tried to be driven entirely by users There was a need, so we tried to cater to it We didn t say, We re going to try to crush Microsoft just to crush Microsoft That wasn t the intent, even though that s kind of the stated goal of some misguided open source projects Whereas Microsoft, they win a browser war, so in 2001, they bow out Which is completely irresponsible, because this is the most used software application in the world, and they just stopped developing it Now they are back in the game, because they have competition, so that pulls them back in I will say that Internet Explorer 7 is shaping up to be a good browser; I just wish it came a few years earlier.

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